Annotation of wikisrc/users/schmonz/pkgsrccon2014.mdwn, revision 1.8

1.3       schmonz     1: # Attendees
                      2: 
                      3: * Calum
                      4: * Youri
                      5: * `abs`
                      6: * `justin`
                      7: * `jaapb`
                      8: * `alnsn`
                      9: * Sevan
                     10: * `bsiegert`
                     11: * `mlelstv`
                     12: * `tron`
                     13: * `spz`
                     14: * `prlw1`
                     15: * `wiedi`
1.8     ! schmonz    16: * one fellow I didn't recognize and didn't get to meet
1.3       schmonz    17: * `sborrill`
                     18: * `morr`
                     19: 
1.8     ! schmonz    20: # Thursday
        !            21: 
        !            22: ## Drinks: Doric Arch
        !            23: 
        !            24: * `jaapb`
        !            25: * `alnsn`
        !            26: * another fellow named Alex
        !            27: * `gavan`
        !            28: 
        !            29: # Friday
        !            30: 
        !            31: ## Dinner: Edinboro Castle
        !            32: 
        !            33: * `jaapb`
        !            34: * `mlelstv`
        !            35: * `spz`
        !            36: * `prlw1`
        !            37: * `wiedi`
        !            38: * `sborrill`
        !            39: 
1.1       schmonz    40: # Saturday
                     41: 
1.4       schmonz    42: ## Benny Siegert: "BulkTracker"
1.2       schmonz    43: 
1.4       schmonz    44: * [BulkTracker](http://bulktracker.appspot.com) is WIP to parse
1.2       schmonz    45:   `pkgsrc-bulk` reports and present them in an organized way
                     46: * Uses lots of trendy stuff:
                     47:     * Google App Engine
                     48:     * Ruby, Node.js, Twitter Bootstrap
                     49:     * side comment: pkgsrc is missing some trendy stuff
                     50: * [Source code](http://github.com/bsiegert/bulktracker)
1.1       schmonz    51: 
1.3       schmonz    52: ## Side discussion with Youri and Calum
                     53: 
                     54: * how can we induce people to choose pkgsrc over Homebrew?
                     55:     * most people are looking for an OS-specific package manager
                     56:     * they don't realize they should look for cross-platform
                     57:     * I've learned that I should
                     58:     * we need to attract OS X users on their own terms
                     59:         * what if we managed /Applications, from source or not?
                     60:     * likewise for other platforms
                     61:     * what if we branded pkgsrc differently for each platform?
                     62:     * also concentrate on binary package experience
                     63:     * `pkgin` is a real nice user experience
                     64: * how are people finding their OS X binary packages?
                     65:     * screenshots they post on [/r/unixporn](http://www.reddit.com/r/unixporn)
                     66: 
1.5       schmonz    67: ## Lightning talks
                     68: 
                     69: ### David Brownlee: "Pretty tabular data without much effort"
                     70: 
                     71: * jQuery
                     72: * [example](http://www.netbsd.org/~wiz/perl.html)
                     73: * see also <http://sync.absd.org/www>
                     74: 
                     75: ### Youri Mouton: pkgsrc for new developers
                     76: 
                     77: * used NetBSD and `pkgin` without knowing what pkgsrc was
                     78: * saw `pkgin` supported on other OSes (e.g., Minix)
                     79: * and OS X (a main OS he uses)
                     80: * started manually making packages for `pkgin`, not realizing
                     81: * _then_ understood it was pkgsrc being used to make packages
                     82: * a few months doing bulk builds
                     83: * there isn't a tutorial on how to start as a pkgsrc developer
                     84: * submitted ports to pkgsrc-wip
                     85: * people usually find MacPorts, Homebrew, Fink, and _then_ maybe `pkgin`
                     86: * this is too bad, they ought to be finding us
                     87: * Youri and Calum's project: <http://saveosx.org>
                     88:     * they're doing gpg-signed packages
                     89: * people ask "where can I find documentation" and there isn't a great answer
                     90: * writing clear, clean docs for new users and developers would be great
                     91: * we all think jperkin's writeups and docs on this are terrific
                     92:     * can we have them?
                     93: * tron: bootstrap experience for MacPorts may be nicer
                     94:     * schmonz: should be possible to build a Mac `.pkg` from bootstrap
                     95: * abs: three target demographics:
                     96:     * use binary packages
                     97:     * build from source, use options, don't want to fix things
                     98:     * developers
                     99: * this underscores the need for user-editable wiki
                    100: * design patterns for pkgsrc: e.g., how to fetch from a certain git commit
                    101: * hey, let's take some time as a group and merge `pkgsrc.org` into
                    102:     `wiki.n.o/pkgsrc/`
                    103: 
1.6       schmonz   104: ### Jaap Boender: OCaml packages
                    105: 
                    106: * OCaml has a build system akin to Haskell's "cabal"
                    107: * would like to factor it out, not sure how best to do that
                    108: * (I was busy prepping a talk)
                    109: 
                    110: ### Justin Cormack: cross-compiling
                    111: 
                    112: * with `qemu`, non-native binaries can run from `./configure` and the like
                    113: * syscall emulation
                    114: * (I'm still prepping a talk)
                    115: 
                    116: ### Sevan Janiyan: Mac OS X `powerpc`
                    117: 
                    118: * GCC>4.4 doesn't build with XCode
                    119: * he's managed to get up to 4.7 now
                    120: * next thing GCC 4.8 and then he'll be able to build stuff
                    121: * (I'm still prepping)
1.5       schmonz   122: 
                    123: ### Matthias Scheler: world's best ISP
                    124: 
1.6       schmonz   125: * XKCD 806
                    126: * (still prepping)
                    127: 
                    128: ### Sebastian Wiedenroth: merging trivial fixes
                    129: 
                    130: * (still prepping)
                    131: 
                    132: ### S.P. Zeidler: packaging for TNF servers
                    133: 
                    134: * to be installed on TNF servers, it must be in pkgsrc
                    135: * if it might ever run as root, it must be built on certain protected systems
                    136: * `pkg_chk_(8)` for seeing what needs to be built
                    137: * packages are built in `pkg_comp(8)` with sets matching arch and NetBSD version
                    138: * then they're transferred to the destination systems and `pkg_add(8)`ed
                    139: * vulnerabilities detected with `pkg_admin audit`
                    140: * (missed some details)
                    141: 
1.7       schmonz   142: ### Stephen Borrill: building products with NetBSD and pkgsrc
                    143: 
                    144: * based on 2007 EuroBSDCon presentation
                    145: * thin clients
                    146: 
1.6       schmonz   147: ## Me: "pkgsrc design goals"
                    148: 
1.7       schmonz   149: * blah blah blah
1.6       schmonz   150: * slides forthcoming
1.5       schmonz   151: 
1.8     ! schmonz   152: ## Dinner: Gourmet Garden
        !           153: 
        !           154: * `jperkin`
        !           155: * Calum
        !           156: * Youri
        !           157: * `abs`
        !           158: * `justin`
        !           159: * `jaapb`
        !           160: * `alnsn`
        !           161: * Sevan
        !           162: * `bsiegert` and wife and cute kid
        !           163: * `mlelstv`
        !           164: * `tron`
        !           165: * `spz`
        !           166: * `prlw1`
        !           167: * `wiedi`
        !           168: * that fellow I didn't recognize and haven't gotten to meet
        !           169: * `sborrill`
        !           170: * `morr`
        !           171: 
1.1       schmonz   172: # Sunday
                    173: 
1.8     ! schmonz   174: ## Hackathon
        !           175: 
        !           176: ### Ideas
        !           177: 
        !           178: #### Merge `pkgsrc.org` into `wiki.netbsd.org/pkgsrc/`
        !           179: 
        !           180: 7. `cvs checkout wiki.netbsd.org:/home/pkgwiki/pkgsrc-wiki.cvs`
        !           181: 7. `cvs checkout wiki.netbsd.org:/cvsroot`
        !           182: 7. Copy content from the former to the latter (under `pkgsrc/`)
        !           183: 7. Preview at <http://wiki.netbsd.org/pkgsrc/>
        !           184: 7. Point `{www.,}pkgsrc.org` at that HTML directory
        !           185: 
        !           186: #### Integrate `joerg`'s C wrappers
        !           187: 
        !           188: 7. `hg clone ssh://ftp.netbsd.org/~joerg/cwrapper`
        !           189: 7. Figure out how to get pkgsrc to use them
        !           190: 7. Commit on a branch
        !           191: 7. Do one bulk build on `HEAD` and one on your branch
        !           192: 7. Let's see how it went
        !           193: 
        !           194: #### `[schmonz]` Merge hard-coded pkgsrcCon 2013 site into `wiki.netbsd.org`
        !           195: 
        !           196: 7. Get a local copy of everything
        !           197: 7. Fix up template
        !           198: 7. Get previous sites to not break (maybe not editable)
        !           199: 7. Commit to `pkgwiki`
        !           200: 
        !           201: #### Fix `pkgtools/pkg_regress` tests
        !           202: 
        !           203: 7. The one that was still passing, do we believe that? Can we make it break?
        !           204: 7. The ones that are failing, can we understand them and make them pass?
        !           205: 7. Let's think of something else worth testing and write a new test for it
        !           206: 7. Do we feel good about adding more such tests and encouraging
        !           207:    everyone to do so? If not, what do we need to improve before we
        !           208:    do that?
        !           209: 
        !           210: #### Write an initial pkgsrc "product backlog"
        !           211: 
        !           212: 7. Starting with the work we need to do to make it easier to develop
        !           213:    pkgsrc internals
        !           214: 7. Further down, the developer features we want pkgsrc to have
        !           215: 7. Further down, the user features we want pkgsrc to have
        !           216: 
        !           217: #### Debug why just-in-time `su` sometimes doesn't
        !           218: 
        !           219: 7. It seems to be working just about all the time for nearly everyone
        !           220: 7. It doesn't work for `schmonz` in this case:
        !           221:     * `mail/qmail` (which is not `user-destdir`, only `destdir`)
        !           222:     * on Mac OS X 10.9.3 (haven't tried other systems)
        !           223:     * `make package`
        !           224: 7. It does work for `schmonz` in this similar-looking case:
        !           225:     * `mail/relay-ctrl` (also only `destdir`)
        !           226:     * on Mac OS X 10.9.3
        !           227:     * `make package`
        !           228: 
1.1       schmonz   229: [[!meta title="pkgsrcCon 2014: notes and scratchings"]]

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